THE OMAHA. SUNDAY BEE: SEPTEMBER 28, 1913.
5B
Talk with Uncle Sam's Industrial Diplomat
w
(Copyright, U18, by Frank O. Carpenter.)
ABHINGTON, I. C. Here In
brief It the story of the nan
who represents twenty add
million homey-handed laborers
jgTjSl of the United BUtes In the
KZZSZjJ cabinet of President Wilson,
.born In Scotland, fifty years aio, the eon
ol a. minor. Coming to the United states at
the aso of 8 and at 9 delving; In the coal
pits of the Allegheny mountains. From;
.that time on, until he was 36, his boy
hood and young manhood waB spent In
the darkness, swinging-the pick, drilling
and blasting; and loading; the coal on
the cars. Then a fireman 6n a rail
road locomotive and a worker at odd
jobs; at sawmlllinfc and ditching;. Then
mining between times and tilling moun
tain land on the shares. -At l&tt a pretty
farm owner of 100 acres of hills and hol
lows, 'and finally, to cut short the story,
a member of congress, who was re
elected again' and again as a representa
tive" of labor, and now a cablnot minister
with, a salary of $12,000 a year.
This sounds like a story of the days of
Aladdin. It la only the plain, simple '
annals of th evolution which Is con
stantly rolnr on in our American life
It shows what a boy can make of him
self and how, with everything apparently
Mralnst him, he need not despair.
1.1 fo of Hannal Labor.
Bo much by way of introduction to my
Interview with Mr. William Bauchop
"Wllsorf, the head of the Department of
Labor. I give It to show you that he
htm a right to represent the working
men of the. United States In our national
government The Information came from
the secretary upon my asking whether
be had ever worked with his hands. .He
rerlled:
"The gi eater part of my life has been
spent.-in hard, manual labor. I swung
a pick In the ooal mines for twenty
seven years, and that as a miner, not
as a Jboso. I entered the mines as a boy
to help my father load coat. My father
was a miner, and all the money we got
came from the amount of coal ho could
mine. Ila was paid by the ton and upon
the output depended our living. This
M the situation when I reached the
age. of 9 years. Then father had a bad
attack of lumbago. His back was so
weal; and so painful that he could not
lift the coal from the floor of the mlno
to the cars. He was all right from his
.walat upward, and could still sit on
the. .floor et the mine and undercut the
coal with a pick, but he could not stoop
td load It I was taken down Into the
mines and did the loadlnr. Later on, he
taught me how to aid him In drilling,
and I finally learned all kinds of mining.
Father and I worked together for seven
years, and after .that I had a place for
myself. I continued mining coal, for
' twenty years Jdnge'r, and later on mined
coal In the winter time and worked on
the farm In the summer."
, Edacatci at' Rome.
"Tour wages must have been small In
those days?"
"Ten, they were small. Until I was 84
years of age, I do not think I ever made
as much as $40 a month the year round.
I sometimes made as high as tSO a
month, but' lean seasons always suc
ceeded the ' fat, ones and kept down the
average," . ,
Theee.words of the secretary were' in
good-'English i 'and his talk' throughout
waamore, .like that ot a oollege bred
. man thaa .ene Wh6f. life had heea' spent
Sfi AraV,1 manual', labor, 1 wwsdsred and
asked him where he get Ms education.
X refititdf
"X oeuld not go to 'sense! on aecswat f J
my work,, but I was fortunate ltfcat'iar .J
wer was one oi mose .argumentative
(Scotchmen who not only ioVe'd to debate,
but gloried In haying his facts backed by
the best of authorities. He1 was not an
educated man; and ooutd not read very
well, and so made me read fa him. Sly
mother, wita had a common sihool educa-1
tlon, tanght me my letters, and I soon
learned to read. After that father kept
me reading to him every night and by
the timo I was 9 or 10 years of -age I had
read ;fhe whole of Smith's "Wealth pf
Nations' and other books on political
economy. I bad read a great deal ot
Chambers' Information for the People.
The1 Science of the Bible,' some works of
Drommond and ,a little later on I read
Earns and Campbell, Shelley and other
&eiia. We had also Scott and Dickens,
and I got to know them. As to the Bible,
sstther was a rigid " Presbyterian. In
Sfletikmd Tie belonged to what they called
tlrtWeo Kirk,' and, ot course, wo read
a sweat deal of the scripture. As I look
baok.-vpon those days I can see that this
was liooi literary training, and can
realise how much effect It had upon my
mind. -I had a good memory, and this
was stlaulated by my father calling upon
me to Corroborate his quotations from
the authorities' used In his arguments.
"Shortly afjer. I began work In the
mines, - ma secretary continued, "our
community arranged for a night school.
Every pupil paid $1 a nlonth to the prin
cipal, and for a time I was, able to attend
that I did also considerable studying , at
home, and so In one way and another I
have gotten what little education I have.
I was for a time a printer and stuck
type for the Bostwlck Advertiser. This
taught me punotuation and gave taa
some insight Into grammatical construe
tlon. But altogether, as you can see, my
eaucauon has-been very little."
Alvmys a Union Una,
"When did you first become connected
with labor organisations?"
i can naraiy remember when I was
rot aport of them. I became a limited
member of a labor union when I was
ttlrtetn. and I have bean more or less
associated with unions ever since. I am
a Union man now, and have my union
card. When I was IS I was victimized
for my activity n the mines as a trade
unionist and was ordered to leave. That
wps what drove me to the west and
made me a fireman on a railway loco-
,'$r ..... r. . . .lT..TirT n... ...... Jlffi
motive. After my return to Pennsylvania i strikes are better organised. The trades
I did what I could for the Interests of which are, the best organized hajro the'
tho miners, and later on I wad secretary fewest strikes, and as the organisation of
of the United Mine Workers. That organ
ization has over 3,000,000 members, and
has done much to better the conditions
of labor In the mines all over the country."
"You were elected to congress as a
laboring man, were you not?"
"Yes, It was largely the support of the
workingnien that brought about my
nomination and election, and It la. I' sup
pose, my Identification with and Interest
In labor matters that has put me here."
"Is there any story connected with your
appointment as secretary of labor?"
Not that I know of. I was not an ap
plicant for the place, "and when my name
was proposed I olinpiy nald that I would
appreciate the hone f It came to roe.
My Idea of this p-.. on was tod. high
for mo to be an applicant for It"
"Value ot Trade Union.
Mr. Secretary, have you ever doubted
the value of the trades union to the la
boring man?"
'No, I believe In the talon. I boiler
in organization as a means of protection
for all kinds of labor. My viewpoint of
the relation between the employer and
the employe la snob that I cannot see
how the latter could s sours even a small
share of Justice without organization, t
look upon any industry as a partnership
In Which the employer and the employes,
are the partners In production. They
have a mutual Interest In securing the
largest production" 'for a given amount
to a' division otJhe .profits ,th'af their In
terests .begta to diverge.
At that point the workmen can only
ast- e2eetlvljr -to -any TMtvantasre. if
they act Individually the Individual la
borer who. objects Is at a great disad
vantage ,as! compared with his employer.
If the man la cuesausnea ana aecunes
to continue work, he Is out of a Job, and
Is crippled to 100 per cent ot his produc
ing ' capacity; On the other hand the
employer la .crippled only to; the extent
that that man's work represents In his
total output Kow It the employes act
collectively and they stop work, the
whole machine must, stop. The employer
Is crippled to 100 per 'cent of his produc
ing, capacity, and; .the employes are. like
wise crippled' In -the same amount They
are then on an equal basis and there. Is
a chance to make a settlement Tho
trades union Is absolutely essential to
the rights of Wot.'
What the DevHrtmeat May Do.;
"What can this department do to bet
ter tho relation between labor and cfcpl
tal?"
"The Department '-. of Labor Is rather
ah advtsorydepartroent than an axe'bu
tlve department It mght be called a
department.. of Industrial, diplomacy. . Its
object Is largely to act as' a mediator be
tween capital and labor In case 'of dty
nute. and f believe that It wIllLKe bane
ftclal to the community at large to Just
that extent that its diplomacy, succeeds.1
"But la the laboring man willing to ac
cept Uncle Sam as his arbitrator?"
"I do not mean that Uncle Sam Is to
be the arbitrator, ibut'that he Is to bring
the parties, together and to get them to
mutually submit tneir differences to
other arbitrators to be chosen them
selves. It would not be wise for the
government to act as an arbitrator, for
the reason that wrong precedents might
bo established.- The conditions In one
place might not bo suited to the deda
Ions to which the arbitrator had com
mitted itself in other places. Again, the
decision of today might be unjust in the
changed conditions of-tomorrow, Prog
ress Is always being mode, and situa
tions ore continually changing. 'If this
department were tied down to a 'line of
decisions, along a given direction, It
would stand in the way ot progress It
self."
"But what can you do?"'
I v. vwj w. . n., V-." , whvhjv i " -
and perhaps suggest plans, of settlement! Connecticut the hours of labor are eight
I suppose I could answer your question! unless omerwiso agreed, and engineers,
better by telling you what we have done firemen and machinists and other me
wlthln the. .past few months. We toolci chnnlcs employee in state Institutions
up fee adjustment of the trade disputes' may not work more than eight hours
connected with the New York, Newi except tn cases of emergency. In nearly
Haven & Hertford railroad, and suo-all the states eight hours Is the rule
cecuea, in urinit uro eiiiiuupa uui ,mo uyuu bui yuunu nurm, saa ii is nearly
company together, so that they have ad-: everywhere so In the mines and smelt
Justed their dispute In a way satisfactory; ere. It is so In Illinois In all mechanical
to both parties. We have arranged' in employments, and It Is so on the nub-
C. M. P.: The neck should receive sim- the same way a difficulty In the forge Ho highways. Klght hours Is the rule In
lol ao'colo? a 'teitSSfSVi16 department at Erie, and we have brought Indiana, and.lt Is" so In Massachusetts
iuq cuuio. v jrviiutY nccji ana a wmte " v- u..v piuyivcu
fact give a discordant effect I advise Railroad company together. We have by or on behalf of the state. 1 tnlEht so
on and show tho some for nearly every
state In the Union."
Farm Work Different.
"How about work on the farms? Take
your farm In Pennsylvania, Could you
run that on an eight-hour day?"
"I do not "know about that, Ther Is a
difference between' the work on the farm
and the work in the various Industries.
The most of the state laws make a. dif
ference as to the work on the farm and
In 'many cases such labor is especially
exempt from the regulations as to other
labor. The season for farm work is
labor' becomes more complete the strikes!
become less and less. The reason for
this Is that collective bargaining Is more
easily possible under that condition. Both
parties to the contract are better able
to fix terms and carry them out"
"Do you think that a general atrlk aU
over tho country is possible?"
"No."
"What Is the Ideal condition that should
exist between the employer 'and the
ployo?"
"A condition of partnership and of
equal rights. There is an implied part
nership now, but the difficulty Is that
tho employer dbes not recognize It He
assumes that his plant in his property,
and that he has a right to do with It as
he pleases and to run it as he pleases.
He falls to grasp the Idea that there is
no title to property that Is not a law
created and law-protected title. Society
has allowed private individuals or cor
porations to hold certain rights only for
Us protection and development Now, li
society has created the title, for its pro
tection, society can modify that tltia
whenever it deems necessary tor its pro
tection. Therefore when the employer
claims the factory as his own to do with
as he pleases, he falls to realize that he
has no title to tho factory except la lo
far as society permits."
"That Would mean that 'society has the
right to change the regulation ot any
such piece of property at Its own will?"
"That condition already exists in law
and that right has always been reserved
by the governing power. It is the title ot
eminent domain, the rigSt ef-the, govern
ment to determine that certain things
are of .stich .eminent good to the com-'
mnnlty'rthat the community .can tako
them ov.er and manage them itselfi The
railroad, in getting its right-of-way. k
able to condemn property through that
principle, and It la so with other thing
The average man ails to realize this,
and the, employer cannot see that prop
erty is omy law-created and law-pro
tected and that its regulation can be
changed by society as .the conditions of
society demand."
Some Live Toyicw.
v The conversation here turned to some-of
the live labor questions of today, and
I asked the secretary It he believed In a
minimum wage. He replied) '
"I have pronounced views on that sub
ject, but It would not be wise for ms to
discuss them."
"Do you think the Industries of the
United States can be run on an eight-
nour aayr'
"I have no doubt of it, and X bell are
that there are many industries in whloh
the workman Will produce as much 'la
eight hours as he did in tan, While I
was chairman of the committee on labor
la -the house, I received a communication
from a large employer tn the sranlta In
pastry, giving the results of .his experi
ments in his works as to the product as
affected by the hours per day per man.
He kept records of the hours and the out
put When he began bis men were la
boring ten hours a day. He reduced them
to nine, and found that the product was
greater than w;hen they worked ten. Ho
then reduced the hours to eight, and
found that he got inoro work Out of the
men at eight hours than he, did at nlnoi
He expected to continue the reduction.
and sold that be believed tho highest out
put would be reached when the hours of
labor were reduced to the point whera
the workman came back to bis work
every morning fully refreshed."
ElgUt-ironr Work-Day.
"Will the. time come when we will have
an eight-hour day everywhere in the
United States?"
"That is tlje condition now In most of
tho states in many industrial .occupa
tions. In Arizona we have the eight-hour
day law In underground mines and work
lngs. In California the same Is true as to
mines, 'smelters and public works of any
kind, and it is Hkewiso so In Colorado. In
closely regulated as the work ot a fac
tory or In the various industries. As to
cur other industries, however, there is no
doubt but that the eight-hour day Is
praotical and beneficial both to the tm-
ployer and the employe."
"Do you think we will ever- have less
than an sight-hour day?"
"That Is possible. There are some in
dustries in England where the day Is
now less than eight' hours. This has
been the case for the last thirty years
In tho coal mines of Northumberland,
where the men have been working only
six hours a day."
Conditions Are Improving;.
"Are the conditions of labor Improv
ing?" "Yes, thoro is no doubt of that"
"What would you say about organised
labor as a trust? Why should It not be
handled on the same ground as other
monopolies?"
"I have already answered that question,
but I would say that an organization
should not be oppo&od or destroyed sim
ply because It Is an organization. The
laws for centuries have permitted the or
ganization of ffiMinmtlii minti n--
missions will be continued. The opposl
! tlon to trusts and monopolies arises bo-
ium mey enaoie a tew men to oictate
to the producer what he shall reoelve
for his production and to the consumer
what ho shall pay for the things he con
sumes. This con never be the case with
labor organizations, such an organlza
tlon cannot be composed of a few In
dividuals. It must be an organisation ot
the multitude, and It must be always for
the purpose of endeavoring to secura for
the producer as equitable share ot that
which he produces and at the same time
It can never be an organization whloh
will regulate the price to the consumer.
Tne labor organisation is thus founded
upon an entirely different basts from the
capital organisation. It should not be
regarded as a trust It cannot be a
monopoly tn that sense of the word."
"Then you think It should b governed
by different laws?"
"Tes. The laws should be adapted to
It, and based upon the difference ot con
dition which actually exists.
FRANK O. CARPENTER
'Aunt Sally's Advice .
to Beauty-Seekers
BBSSrf MSm-fM -
w r
ueJoffJfoi both-Heck and complexion, tho i averted a number of atrikoa and we arl
SC 1M First. Stbp scowUni. F you ttat J?"! .
would get rid of the lines between the i "Supposo the strikers at Paterson had
eyes.' iue nest application iov such lines.
A ..W n lr 1 I. l.P.1ll.. .
and all wrinkles. Is a 'solution of nor.
dareA. saxollte, 1 ox., dissolved in witch
hazel; 44 .pint Bathe the face In this
dally i until entirely relieved.
Moraca: You hardly need such a list
of cosmetics as you mention. Ordinary
mercollzed wax will hJp you, more than
any or" all of them. It will gradually
absorb the withered, dUcolortd complex
ion and you will toon havo a new, youth
ful and healthr-Iooklng skin. You needn't
get more than an ounce of the wax,,
,- which Will Dost you Uttle at any drug
.glaf. Apply nffhtly like cold oream.
'wachlac it oft mornlngtv-Woaaa's
JUia. AdTct!ist.
asked you to step In?"
"I cannot say what would havo been
the result We might have succeeded
In getting the parties to Ether, We, could
only have suggested and advised. We
are as I have s&ld, merely a department1
of 1 Industrial diplomacy.
Strikes Fewer, bat litsrirer.
"How about strikes In the . United
State? Aro they increasing?'
"No.. I believe we have fewer strikes
DivBffmFsUasv
Sanatorium
This Institution is the onlr one
in tho central west with, separate
buildings situated la their own
ample grounds, yet entirely dis
tinct, and rendering it possible to
clleslfy cases. The one building
being fitted tor and devoted t the
treatment of non-contagious and
non-mental disease, no ethers be
ing admitted; the other Rest Cot
tage being deeigaed , for aat de
voted te the exclusive treataeat
of select mental cases rettiriBg
fer a time watehfal ear a&d is,
elal surging.
I HOME FURNITURE CO
20 Below Omaha Prices,
Not one Pay, But Every Day
South
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. HI - . - fM"
I j 9x12 Seamless Velvet Sagy?!. ....... ,. Jl50
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I Our Fall Stock How Complete 1
I BSslyM This Week We Of for Sped! Prices on Dining Room Furniture
I Buffet, China OloMti, Table tad. ,: : ' Jp . ; I
Chain in Oolden 0k, Wax. ' ' Ch MR I
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Full Line of Bedding, Pillows, JSQKv' HSPLAY I
I Oomforta and Blankets s2HHSflb ROOM I
I Much Below Omaha. Prices fljHHEpjjHT? JUT I
I LOW PRICES ON GOOD STOVES HhMkSBXB , 69M- M
I Famous Quick Meal Sang m pBHJplH FLETEI I
titovea Bold on Payment e2T
' Sit ft
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SaJ OMAHA. NEB.
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V.
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O M A H A... .'..-r ..
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Violins
Complete tritli
cmwi, bow ml
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Persistent AdvortiBuig is tho Bo ad- to Big Bo turns
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ADVXllTISXWd IS THU
OKLY wm
to get tnooess ta msiaets.
iBOmeoM oaos nm
Jwuat: ''Tou.wJdbistip
advHie aowr or the iter,
iff will rtverti. for 70a
lNr.M TU sheriff did.
